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J.L.Hufford Supporter Forum > Coffee & Espresso Machines > Coffee/ Espresso Machine Reviews > Jura Caprsso Impressa F7 vs. E8 |
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J.L.Hufford Supporter Forum > Coffee & Espresso Machines > Coffee/ Espresso Machine Reviews > Jura Caprsso Impressa F7 vs. E8 |
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| Jura Caprsso Impressa F7 vs. E8 | Rate Topic |
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| Posted: Mon Jan 10th, 2005 09:24 pm |
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1st Post |
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NancyG Member
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I am trying to figure out which model to buy. Any pros or cons? Also, can you brew regular coffee as well as espresso? Do you have to take out the beans from one in order to brew the other?
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| Posted: Fri Jan 14th, 2005 04:42 am |
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2nd Post |
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hufford_technical Administrator
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Thank you for your participation in the forum. "Which machine should I buy", with regard to Capresso super-automatics, is a common question that we get at JL Hufford. Let us focus on the two machines you mention, the Jura-Capresso Impressa E8 and the Jura-Capresso Impressa F7. The F7 and E8 both use the finest super-automatic brewing technology on the market, have a separate bypass doser (which allows you to enter ground coffee directly into the machine, bypassing whatever beans are in the bean hopper), have digital displays, have a single heating system, have the ability to grind up to 16 grams of coffee per brew, and can brew up to 16 ounces of espresso coffee per brew. This last part addresses one of your particular questions. Both machines can make "crema coffee", or coffee that is produced under high pressure that has a crema (burnt-caramel colored colloid of sugars that appears on the top of your coffee drink). High-pressure brewed coffee extracts less of the bitter oils you get in drip brewed coffee. Crema coffee is not the same as espresso, as crema coffee is generally brewed on a coarser grind than espresso. Both crema coffee and espresso can be made with a good dark and medium espresso blend, like JL Hufford's espresso blend, although some folks still prefer a darker roast for espresso drinks. These, in addition to many other features of the Impressa series from Jura-Capresso, are some of the most significant characteristics of both machines. So why is the F7 more expensive than the E8? UNLIKE THE E8, THE F7:
Thank you again for your participation in the forum
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| Posted: Wed Apr 27th, 2005 08:41 pm |
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3rd Post |
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rollis Member
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Thank you for the valuable info on the Capresso Machines! Will you indulge me in my quest? I was the owner of a Starbucks (SAECO) Digital Italia ($995 street) which recently died after 9 months of use. Starbucks gave me a full refund and discontinued their version of the machine so now I am looking for a new machine. I loved this machine! The only thing it lacked is the froth express where you can steam milk srtaight into your cup. THis would appear to be a worthwhile accessory on the Capresso machines. Should I buy the SAECO Incanto Sirius ($1,499 street) from Williams-Sonoma (lifetime warranty), or the Capresso F7 or maybe F9? A dear friend has the E8 after having owned the SAECO ITalia and is unhappy with coffee temp and lag time between brewing and steaming. I believe that the insides are the same from the E8 to the F7/F9 so I might be disappointed as well. However, the steam wand is what broke on the Digital Italia and the Digital Italia and the Incanto are the same machines (it would appear) other than the fancy electronics. I would greatly appreciate your thoughts. I don't mind going the additional $500 but don't really want to go for the S class (unless someone forces me to  ) Am really interested in the whole froth express.Look forward to hearing from you, great board! Rollis
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| Posted: Wed Apr 27th, 2005 09:26 pm |
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4th Post |
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hufford_technical Administrator
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The Saeco Incanto series includes an entire family of Saeco products. The first ones were actually the Italias (not digital Italias) which were Starbucks-only products. There are now a lot of Incanto machines, but only a few are available in the United States, with W.S. having the first lot of Serius Incanto machines. The Serius will, after some time, be available through other dealers like ourselves. You can determine if a Saeco machine is an Incanto series unit by the spout; they all have the brew head with a curved top and two small spouts, a lot sleeker than spouts on their predecessors. With regard to coffee temperature, you should not see a major difference between the Saeco or Jura-Capresso. Your friend may not like the temperature of the coffee, but do you know how hot it is? I am surprised to hear that he finds it not as hot as the Saeco, as both units make coffee that comes out of the spout at about 180 degrees. Lots of things will affect temperature, including: grind size (finer=hotter), amount of coffee per brew (more coffee=hotter), preheating, and--of course--heating the cups before brewing into them. We have bench tested the Italia here and have not noticed a hotter brew from the Italia. However, your friend may be brewing larger drinks with the E8 but still using a small amount of water, as the E8 can brew twice as much liquid as the Italia. This can make a difference. With regard to switching from brewing to steaming, there should generally be no more than a 20 second wait for the unit to warm up to steaming temp; and that holds true for both the Saeco and the Jura-Capresso. The F7 and F9 are very similar to one another. Both give you excellent control over the coffee drink that best fits your taste preferences, more so than the E8. This is what you are paying for with the F series (See post below). With regard to the S series, you get all the control that the F gives, plus much more. Additionally, there are two heating elements in each machine, so there is zero wait time between brew-steam and steam-brew transitions, as opposed to the normal 30 seconds in other Jura-Capresso (and Saeco) machines. Additionally, the Jura-Capresso S and Z series are the hottest brewing machines on the market. I noticed that we do have an S7 in stock as well as an open-box S8. One of these plus a Froth Xpress add-on at $80.00 would be great ways to get into an S series machine without paying for the S9, since the S9's difference is just color (and the Froth Xpress being standard, rather than an add-on). Most of the Incanto Series units are the same, save for one that will be coming out some time this year. It's main difference will be that it holds a bit more coffee powder (around 12 grams) than the other Saeco units (which hold around 9 grams), but still not as much as a Jura-Capresso machine. At the end of the day, the big difference between Saeco and Jura-Capresso is that Jura-Capresso can hold up to 15 grams of coffee powder in its brew chamber, and can brew up to 16 oz of coffee liquid per brew. Saeco brew groups, on the other hand, can hold up to 9 grams of coffee powder, and brew up to 8 oz of coffee per brew. The two brew groups are quite different from one another. Brew to steam times shouldn't be significantly different between any Jura-Capresso machine and any Saeco "Rapid Steam" machine. With the Jura-Capresso units, what you pay for is the options. If you want the optional drink controls, you move up the ladder from C->E->F->S->Z. All of the E, F, and S machines can have the Froth Xpress add-on added for an additional $80.00 (and the S9 includes the S9). It is a very convenient device for foaming and steaming milk for any drink. It will not get the milk much hotter than 150-160 degrees, but that is about the benchmark in most coffee houses. You can see it in action on any of the virtual tour pages, like http://www.jlhufford.com/capresso/s9virtualtour.htm. If your Jura-Capresso steam wand happens to break, it will be repaired or replaced free of charge within the first year. I hope that I have answered all of your questions. But let us know if we can be of further assistance. Thank you for your participation in the forum.
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| Posted: Thu Apr 28th, 2005 03:31 pm |
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5th Post |
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rollis Member
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Thanks for the info on dosing. In the past I tried to make a full cup of coffee in the Digital Italia and it always came out weak. I suppose being able to adjust the coffee amount and getting larger doses would be a tremendous help. I noticed on the new Sirius that the burr grinder is now ceramic. Any thoughts on the Ceramic over stainless? You have peaked my interest in the S8 Capresso unit and I am looking at the open box special. What is the extended service plan that you offer? I do like how quiet the E8 and S6 are compared to the SAECO unit I had. (The dog goes nuts) My main concern at this point is dropping $2000 on a unit and it going bad after one year. How is Capresso with warranty service after your one year expiration? Starbucks had a three year unconditional warranty on the SAECO so I never dealt with them directly but I understand they can be difficult. thanks for the discussion. I have found no one elsewhere with such knowlegde and experience.
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| Posted: Thu Apr 28th, 2005 04:57 pm |
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6th Post |
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hufford_technical Administrator
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Thank you for your participation in the forum. STRENGTH Adjusting the coffee powder quantity will make a difference in the strength of the coffee, as will adjusting the fineness setting (finer=stronger), the brew temperature (hotter=stronger), and the water quantity (less=stronger). GRINDER The jury is currently out on the ceramic grinder. It has passed UL approval, which means that it has ground thousands of cycles without breaking, but other than that it is yet difficult to tell how the ceramic material will hold up in the long run. The advantage is a quieter grind. WARRANTY All of the units we sell, including the open box S8, include a one year manufacturer's warranty. This is true for both Saeco and Capresso. The main distinction within warranty period is that with Saeco, you will pay for shipping to get a product to the repair facility, should that need arise. Jura-Capresso pays to pick the unit up from you. Both companies cover the cost of shipping the unit back to you. POST-WARRANTY We offer an extended service contract on most of our Saeco units for an additional year of service. This is usually offered at no additional cost, and you can determine which units come with them by reading the product details. The service contract is provided by a company called Warrantech, and you can read about the contract by clicking here. Jura-Capresso works differently, since they pay for the pick-up and are the only authorized repair facility. With Jura-Capresso you can opt to purchase additional years of service. The extended service usually currently costs an additional $150.00/year, and covers everything the original warranty covered. If it is just parts that you need, in the past Capresso has been very good about shipping out the parts even after the warranty period at no additional cost. We again appreciate your participation in our forum
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| Posted: Sun May 15th, 2005 03:28 am |
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7th Post |
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beef Guest
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rollis, What was you decision? I'm in the same predicament as you. My digital Italia died last week and I'm in a quandry as to whether wait for the second coming of Italia or launch out with the jura-capresso family. I was leaning toward the E8 because of price point similiar to the SAECO, but now I'm confused with what an additional $500 gets when you jump up to the F7. If the single E8 temp setting is as hot as the highest F7 temp setting then I don't see much of an advantage with F7. My only real question is if you can steam/froth with the Jura machines as long as you could with the SAECO product line. The 120 second timer has me confused. BTW, customer service with Starbucks was excellent. I had the digital italia for two years. Received full refund- no questions asked - hassle free. I've read some reviews on AMAZON that didn't speak highly of Capresso customer service. Hmmm  beef
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| Posted: Wed Jan 11th, 2006 11:29 pm |
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8th Post |
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rollis Member
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Wow, guess I am a bad responder, sorry about that. Never got the message - UPDATE- I received a full refund from Starbucks (great company! and I faithfully buy their coffee, even though I do know I could do better) I Did indeed buy the SAECO Incanto from Williams Sonoma. The new Incanto has the ceramic burr grinder. It is a terrific machine. My only complaint is the panello wand bubbles the milk and you are not able to get the micro foam that I like so much on my capaccino. Also, I bought a Capresso Z5 for the office - now that's a machine, but at a price! my .02, SAECO is a good value for home! cheers, rollis
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